DISQUS

RichardA · 2 years ago

I do agree with you Ryan. Wine is all about preferences. And everyone likes different wines. Should winemakers only make superb wine? If we outlawed high alcohol wines, what would be next? Eliminate white Zinfandel. Get rid of two buck Chuck wines? Where do you draw the line?


Educate the consumer about wines. That is the solution. Teach them about all of their options. But don't eliminate their options.



Richard

RichardA · 2 years ago

I did want to add one thing. Dunn did make a request for reviewers to add the alcohol content to their reviews. How many bloggers already do that? I know that I do not. It does seem that fact is excluded from many reviews. Is it time we did add it to our reviews?

RichardA · 2 years ago

Ok, Cellar Tracker and Snooth both don't list alcohol levels.

Ryan · 2 years ago

Good question. I might be in favor of this, I do add it to some wines, but am not consistent. I think that the Social TN sites should consider it though...

Jennifer Beck · 2 years ago

I don't understand why you say the comment from Tom is dumb when all he is saying is that he likes to taste the subtle offerings in the wine instead of being hit over the head with it. Why are you judging him and calling his comment dumb? That is his opinion and shared by many people.

Ryan · 2 years ago

I'm not saying he is dumb, just that the comment is. He's saying that low alcohol is preferable. For me low alcohol is prefereable too, but I don't want to tell winemakers that they need to make low alcohol wines. Tastes change, morph and evolve, to say that winemakers need to start making lower alcohol wines when people enjoy what they are making seems silly. If you don't, as I don't,enjoy the big monster red wines, great! Then don't buy them. This is the exact quote that I think is dumb: "It may not be bad. But it's not good." saying that wines that are high alcohol, even if you like, them are BAD? What does that mean. Sherry, a light aperitif, consumed before the meal, white and usually between 15-18% alcohol is, according to this statement, "not good". Sorry that is a silly statement at the very least.


Also Monastrell from Alicante is regularly over 15% and is often quite balanced, if he gives an exception for Zinfandel, then he should give an exemption for other wines too.

RichardA · 2 years ago

I do agree with you Ryan. Wine is all about preferences. And everyone likes different wines. Should winemakers only make superb wine? If we outlawed high alcohol wines, what would be next? Eliminate white Zinfandel. Get rid of two buck Chuck wines? Where do you draw the line?

Educate the consumer about wines. That is the solution. Teach them about all of their options. But don't eliminate their options.

Richard

RichardA · 2 years ago

I did want to add one thing. Dunn did make a request for reviewers to add the alcohol content to their reviews. How many bloggers already do that? I know that I do not. It does seem that fact is excluded from many reviews. Is it time we did add it to our reviews?

RichardA · 2 years ago

Ok, Cellar Tracker and Snooth both don't list alcohol levels.

Ryan Opaz · 2 years ago

Good question. I might be in favor of this, I do add it to some wines, but am not consistent. I think that the Social TN sites should consider it though...

Jennifer Beck · 2 years ago

I don't understand why you say the comment from Tom is dumb when all he is saying is that he likes to taste the subtle offerings in the wine instead of being hit over the head with it. Why are you judging him and calling his comment dumb? That is his opinion and shared by many people.

Ryan Opaz · 2 years ago

I'm not saying he is dumb, just that the comment is. He's saying that low alcohol is preferable. For me low alcohol is prefereable too, but I don't want to tell winemakers that they need to make low alcohol wines. Tastes change, morph and evolve, to say that winemakers need to start making lower alcohol wines when people enjoy what they are making seems silly. If you don't, as I don't,enjoy the big monster red wines, great! Then don't buy them. This is the exact quote that I think is dumb: "It may not be bad. But it's not good." saying that wines that are high alcohol, even if you like, them are BAD? What does that mean. Sherry, a light aperitif, consumed before the meal, white and usually between 15-18% alcohol is, according to this statement, "not good". Sorry that is a silly statement at the very least.

Also Monastrell from Alicante is regularly over 15% and is often quite balanced, if he gives an exception for Zinfandel, then he should give an exemption for other wines too.

Tom Wark · 2 years ago

"I’m not saying he is dumb, just that the comment is. He’s saying that low alcohol is preferable. For me low alcohol is prefereable too, but I don’t want to tell winemakers that they need to make low alcohol wines."


Why not? I say tell them to make lower alcohol wines. I say implore them too. Nothing changes unless you ask for it.



That said, this is good post, Ryan. I certainly enjoyed it. And while I don't think my comment was "dumb" I do recognize your right to say it is! :)



Cheers,





Tom...

Tom Wark · 2 years ago

"I’m not saying he is dumb, just that the comment is. He’s saying that low alcohol is preferable. For me low alcohol is prefereable too, but I don’t want to tell winemakers that they need to make low alcohol wines."

Why not? I say tell them to make lower alcohol wines. I say implore them too. Nothing changes unless you ask for it.

That said, this is good post, Ryan. I certainly enjoyed it. And while I don't think my comment was "dumb" I do recognize your right to say it is! :)

Cheers,
Tom...

ryan · 2 years ago

Yeah I guess I don't want to tell them to change, because their wines are not enjoyable to me. In this world there a thousands, if not hundred of thousands of wines to enjoy, and a few over alcohol wines isn't going to hurt my enjoyment of wine in general.

Ryan Opaz · 2 years ago

Yeah I guess I don't want to tell them to change, because their wines are not enjoyable to me. In this world there a thousands, if not hundred of thousands of wines to enjoy, and a few over alcohol wines isn't going to hurt my enjoyment of wine in general.

Tim · 2 years ago

The way I read Tom's comment (and Randall Dunn's) was it's a critique of wine ctitics who say that only wines with a high alcohol level can be considered the best wines. I think Tom is making the same argument as you, only in a different way. His argument to me says, "give us choices" not just high alcohol wine because we're told it's better with more alcohol.


Personally, I prefer 13-14% when pairing with food. More at other times.



Finally, why are you bringing up sherry? Sherry is a fortified wine, which makes it not even part of this debate.

Tim · 2 years ago

The way I read Tom's comment (and Randall Dunn's) was it's a critique of wine ctitics who say that only wines with a high alcohol level can be considered the best wines. I think Tom is making the same argument as you, only in a different way. His argument to me says, "give us choices" not just high alcohol wine because we're told it's better with more alcohol.

Personally, I prefer 13-14% when pairing with food. More at other times.

Finally, why are you bringing up sherry? Sherry is a fortified wine, which makes it not even part of this debate.

bbennett · 2 years ago

Ryan says "let the market decide". I agree with that statement. But, how does the "market" determine what to drink? As Tim alludes, they listen to wine critics. Let's just cut to the chase and NAME the man, Robert Parker. This man has almost single-handedly manipulated wine makers around the world into the "International style" of wine. What we are seeing is the logical extension of Parker's preferences. If big and bold is good, why not go bigger and bolder? Fortunately, as Ryan says, there are many, many choices.


Personally, I too prefer lower alcohol wines, and do make that a consideration when contemplating a purchase. The thing is, that what used to be the norm, 12.5%, is getting harder and harder to find. The new normal seems to be around 13.5%.



Having said that, would I prefer to see more lower alcohol wines available at my local wine shop? Absolutely. At the end of the day, I'm looking for some finesse, complexity and finish, not fruit bombs that fry the tongue (and the brain).



So, let the lemmings follow Parker, et al. I will continue on my quest with my own palette (and some assistance from friends like Ryan). By the way, Ryan, I should say that I haven't YET had any Sherry that I like. Is that better? A little more open-ended at least.

bbennett · 2 years ago

Ryan says "let the market decide". I agree with that statement. But, how does the "market" determine what to drink? As Tim alludes, they listen to wine critics. Let's just cut to the chase and NAME the man, Robert Parker. This man has almost single-handedly manipulated wine makers around the world into the "International style" of wine. What we are seeing is the logical extension of Parker's preferences. If big and bold is good, why not go bigger and bolder? Fortunately, as Ryan says, there are many, many choices.

Personally, I too prefer lower alcohol wines, and do make that a consideration when contemplating a purchase. The thing is, that what used to be the norm, 12.5%, is getting harder and harder to find. The new normal seems to be around 13.5%.

Having said that, would I prefer to see more lower alcohol wines available at my local wine shop? Absolutely. At the end of the day, I'm looking for some finesse, complexity and finish, not fruit bombs that fry the tongue (and the brain).

So, let the lemmings follow Parker, et al. I will continue on my quest with my own palette (and some assistance from friends like Ryan). By the way, Ryan, I should say that I haven't YET had any Sherry that I like. Is that better? A little more open-ended at least.

Ryan · 2 years ago

Tim the reason I bring up Sherry a fortified wine, is to show that alcohol levels have nothing to do with not paring well with food. Sherry is a Great food wine, and it has high alcohol. If the wine fits with the fare, it really doesn't matter the alcohol level. Also for those that like low alcohol reds, head to Portugal, while many can be big, I tasted so many INCREDIBLE wines that were around 12.5%....HOW SCHMOLEY!

Ryan Opaz · 2 years ago

Tim the reason I bring up Sherry a fortified wine, is to show that alcohol levels have nothing to do with not paring well with food. Sherry is a Great food wine, and it has high alcohol. If the wine fits with the fare, it really doesn't matter the alcohol level. Also for those that like low alcohol reds, head to Portugal, while many can be big, I tasted so many INCREDIBLE wines that were around 12.5%....HOW SCHMOLEY!